Since the 2016 election heightened America's deep political divides, the mantle of patriotism has become fodder for a bitter tug-of-war. Is it patriotic to leak a presidential secret? To voice dissent during a national rite? Should a general running the White House be deferred to or defied?

In this episode, Atlantic journalists Krishnadev Calamur and Sigal Samuel talk with Khizr Khan, the Gold Star father whose stirring speech at the 2016 Democratic National Convention touched off a famous feud with the President-to-be, about what sacrifice means to him, and why America is worth it. We also hear from a couple veterans who offer their own perspectives on patriotism and military service.

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